Building a business that works without its owner may seem like a far-off dream, but for many entrepreneurs, it’s the ultimate goal. The idea of stepping away from the daily grind while still ensuring the business thrives is one that every ambitious business owner aspires to achieve. But how exactly can you make this happen?
In this episode of The Engaging Marketeer Podcast, Darren sits down with Philip Chantry, an experienced business coach with ActionCOACH, who has not only scaled and sold two businesses but now helps others do the same. With years of experience under his belt, Philip shares invaluable insights on how business owners can grow, scale, and eventually exit their businesses, all while building a system that doesn’t rely on their constant presence.
Whether you’re just starting your business journey or looking to take your existing company to new heights, the advice shared in this blog is packed with practical strategies that can help you create a business that works for you—not the other way around.
Darren Jamieson: Welcome back to another episode of The Engaging Marketeer Podcast! Today, I’m speaking with Philip Chantry, a coach with ActionCOACH. Philip has grown, scaled, and sold two businesses, and now he helps other business owners achieve the same success. We’ll dive into how he helps his clients grow, scale, and exit their businesses, and what advice he has for those looking to make their business run without them.
Phil, you’ve obviously built a career in helping businesses grow, scale, and eventually run without their owners. Can you tell me about the types of businesses you work with and what kind of challenges they typically face?
Philip Chantry: Absolutely, Darren. When I first started coaching eight years ago, I went out with the message that I could help business owners create a business that works without them. At first, I was met with a lot of skepticism. Most people didn’t believe it was possible, as they didn’t know anyone who had done it. Over time, though, it became clear that business owners generally want one of three things: they want to make more money, get better results from their time, or improve results from their team. Those are the core areas I focus on.
For example, I just had a client who was looking to improve team performance and get better results from his time. His financials were good, but he knew that improving team performance and his own time management would unlock more potential. Creating a business that can work without him was also something he had on his radar.
Regarding the types of businesses, I’d say about two-thirds of my clients are in the trades industry. Interestingly, I don’t specifically go out to attract trade businesses, but many of them come to me for help in areas like team growth, improving marketing, or sales. A lot of them aren’t sure what to do with the leads they get or how to present themselves to generate better results.
Darren: You mentioned helping businesses work without the owner. That sounds like an unattainable goal for many, especially when a business owner feels like they are the business. How do you convince them that it’s possible?
Philip: Great question, Darren. If you’re running a business that’s entirely reliant on you…
I’d argue it’s more of a job than a business
A true business is one that can run independently of the owner. It’s about creating a commercial, profitable enterprise that works without you at the helm.
Of course, some people just want a lifestyle business and are fine with being hands-on. But for those who want more freedom—say, to take a vacation without constantly answering calls and emails—this is where creating systems and generating cash flow come in. I work with clients to build that freedom, so they can eventually step away, even if just for a little while, and focus on things they love or want to explore.
This concept of building a business that works without the owner might sound foreign to many, but the truth is that it’s a highly achievable goal when you break it down into the right steps. It all starts with setting up the right systems and processes that allow the business to operate smoothly without constant oversight.
Darren: That makes sense. You work with a lot of trades businesses, but a common issue is the fear of training someone who might eventually leave and become a competitor. How do you help your clients overcome that fear?
Philip: It’s a common issue, for sure. If you have someone who wants to grow and advance, yes, there’s always a risk they might leave and start their own business. But it’s also important to remember that you, as the business owner, have the relationships with your clients. You don’t have to do the work yourself as long as you maintain those key relationships.
Additionally, you can build a strong culture and ensure that multiple people within the company have relationships with clients. That way, you’re not at risk of losing everything if one person decides to leave. Another thing we use is non-compete agreements, although they don’t always prevent employees from starting their own business. Still, they act as a deterrent.
This issue of protecting the business from potential competitors is a real challenge for many business owners, especially in industries like trades, where a lot of knowledge and skills are passed down through the company’s workforce. However, the focus should always be on creating systems that keep the client relationships within the business, not with a single individual. By doing so, the business retains control and scalability.
Darren: That’s interesting. Now, one challenge many businesses face—particularly in trades—is the issue of paying staff during lean times. How do you help your clients manage cash flow in those situations?
Philip: It’s a great question. When business owners face a lean period, they often face the difficult decision of whether they can continue paying their staff, or whether they’ll need to let them go. One approach I recommend is having a mix of paid employees and subcontractors. If business slows down, subcontractors can step in, but they’re not on full-time salaries.
Another piece of advice is to always have a list of go-to subcontractors. It’s important for business owners to not be scrambling when someone leaves or when work slows down. By having a list of trusted people ready to jump in, you won’t be caught off guard, and it gives you flexibility.
Having a well-thought-out cash flow strategy is critical for any business
… particularly in industries like trades, where the flow of projects can be unpredictable. By keeping a roster of reliable subcontractors and staying ahead with financial planning, business owners can ensure they’re not left in the lurch during tough times.
Darren: I’ve seen this issue first-hand, especially in industries like kitchen fitting, where there’s a shortage of skilled labor. How do you help businesses in those industries deal with the skills gap?
Philip: There’s definitely a shortage of skilled workers in the UK right now. I think part of it is that apprenticeships aren’t as popular as they once were. And, there’s this generational shift where some young people might feel entitled to certain things without necessarily being willing to work for them. But it’s not just about blaming the younger generation.
As business owners, we need to ensure that we’re providing proper training and development for our staff. If you’re not properly onboarding or holding people accountable, they may not perform as expected. It’s also about retaining talent, not just attracting the right people. Are we offering career progression, paying them fairly, and providing a positive work environment?
The issue of skills shortages is one that’s increasingly prominent in various industries. It’s not just about finding skilled workers; it’s about ensuring that your business is an attractive place for talent to stay and grow. When business owners create a clear career path for employees, offer competitive pay, and foster a positive culture, they’re far more likely to retain staff in the long term.
Darren: That makes a lot of sense. But how do you handle business owners who are reluctant to admit that they might be part of the problem when it comes to staff issues?
Philip: In my experience, most business owners are willing to admit when they’re part of the issue. I had a client who owned a large kitchen fitting business. When I asked him to rate his man-management skills, he gave himself a one out of ten. We then worked on small steps to improve that score, and over time, he became more self-aware and took action to develop his leadership skills.
Sometimes, though, it’s about recognizing when you’re just not the right person for a role. I’ve worked with business owners who realized that they weren’t the right person to manage their teams, so they hired someone else to take on that responsibility.
This ability to be self-aware and acknowledge when certain skills are lacking is a pivotal moment for many business owners. Leadership isn’t about doing everything yourself—it’s about knowing when to delegate and letting others take charge in areas where they can shine.
Darren: So, business owners need to identify what they’re not good at and hire someone who can handle those areas?
Philip: Exactly. It’s all about finding the right people for the right roles. For instance, one of my clients, a roofing business owner, realized that he wasn’t suited to managing the day-to-day operations of his company, so he hired a managing director to take on that role, while he continued to focus on high-level business strategy.
This approach is fundamental to growing a business
It’s not just about building a team, but about strategically building a team that complements the strengths and weaknesses of the owner.
Darren: That’s fantastic insight, Phil. Now, before we wrap up, I’d love to dive a bit more into how business owners can actually go about achieving these changes. It’s easy to talk about scaling and growing, but what are some of the most common mistakes you see business owners make when trying to create a business that works without them?
Philip: One of the biggest mistakes I see is that business owners don’t delegate effectively. They try to do everything themselves because they either don’t trust others to do it right or they think no one else can do it as well as they can. This keeps them stuck in the business and prevents them from scaling.
Another mistake is not having a clear business plan or goal. Many business owners are great at what they do, but they don’t have a plan for how they’re going to grow or what steps they need to take to eventually exit the business. Without a plan, they’re just drifting, hoping things will work out.
Lastly, I see a lot of business owners who don’t invest enough in their team or in training. You can’t scale your business if your team isn’t equipped to handle the growth. Whether it’s leadership development, marketing knowledge, or systems training, investing in your team is critical.
Darren: Those are some great points. It’s amazing how many business owners think they can do it all, but it really does come down to trusting others and having the right systems in place. Now, I know you offer coaching services to help business owners achieve exactly this, but what advice do you have for those who might be hesitant to take that first step toward scaling?
Philip: I get that. It’s a big decision to invest in coaching, and it’s not always easy to take that first step. But I would say the most important thing is to look at where you are now and where you want to be. Are you happy with where your business is, or do you feel like you’re stuck in the day-to-day grind?
If you’re feeling stuck, coaching could be the catalyst that helps you break free. It’s all about having someone to help you see the bigger picture, identify where you need to improve, and give you the accountability to take action.
But ultimately, it comes down to having a growth mindset. If you’re ready to grow and willing to invest in yourself and your business, coaching can help you get there much faster than you could on your own.
Darren: I think that’s a key point—the mindset shift from being stuck in the day-to-day to seeing the bigger picture. It’s hard to take that first step, but once you do, the possibilities open up. So, for anyone listening who wants to reach out to you, how can they get in touch?
Philip: The best way to reach me is by email at philip.chantry@actioncoach.com. You can also call me directly, or if you prefer, we can schedule a quick consultation to chat about your business and see if there’s a good fit for us to work together. I’m always happy to have that first conversation and help business owners understand what steps they need to take to scale their business.
Darren: Perfect. I’ll make sure to include all your contact information below the podcast for anyone who wants to reach out. Phil, thank you so much for joining me today. I think anyone listening is going to have a ton of takeaways from this conversation.
Philip: Thanks, Darren. It’s been a pleasure chatting with you, and I hope this conversation helps people take that first step toward building a business that works for them, not the other way around.
Darren: Absolutely! That’s the goal. Thanks again, Phil.
More about Philip Chantry:
Philip Chantry is not just a business coach—he is a seasoned entrepreneur with a wealth of real-world experience. Over the years, Philip has successfully grown, scaled, and sold two of his own businesses, giving him a unique understanding of the challenges and opportunities that business owners face. His journey from being a hands-on business owner to a trusted coach has allowed him to build a wealth of knowledge that he now shares with others to help them achieve similar success.
As an ActionCOACH, Philip specializes in helping business owners not only grow and scale their businesses but also create systems and processes that enable them to step away from the day-to-day operations. His coaching style is deeply rooted in practical advice, and he emphasizes the importance of building a business that runs independently of the owner, freeing them to focus on personal goals or other ventures. With a focus on improving cash flow, optimizing team performance, and establishing strong client relationships, Philip works closely with his clients to unlock their business’s true potential.
What sets Philip apart from other coaches is his hands-on experience in growing and selling businesses. Unlike many coaches who operate solely from theory, Philip’s guidance comes from years of trial and error, lessons learned the hard way, and a proven track record of success. If you’re ready to take the next step in scaling your business, Philip’s expertise offers the perfect roadmap for turning your entrepreneurial dreams into a reality.
For anyone looking to make their business work for them, not the other way around, Philip is the kind of coach who can help you get there. With his practical, results-driven approach and a genuine passion for seeing businesses succeed, you’ll be in good hands as you navigate the journey to growth and freedom.
Connect with Philip:
ActionCOACH account: https://philipchantry.actioncoach.co.uk/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bizgrowthspecialist/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/PhilChantryBGC/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6wUkqWjhG0B92icCKv_NNQ
X: https://x.com/philipchantry?lang=en
About your host:
Darren has worked within digital marketing since the last century, and was the first in-house web designer for video games retailer GAME in the UK, known as Electronics Boutique in the States. After co-founding his own agency, Engage Web, in 2009, Darren has worked with clients around the world, including Australia, Canada and the USA.
iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/engaging-marketeer/id1612454837
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/darrenjamieson/
Engaging Marketeer: https://engagingmarketeer.com
Engage Web: https://www.engageweb.co.uk
