Darren Jamieson: On today’s episode of The Engaging Marketeer, I’m speaking with Emma Sidney. Her business is called Sparkle Society, and she is a marketer specialising in lead magnets, landing pages and email automation.
I’m going to be talking to her about creating lead magnets, landing pages and email automation sequences that encourage prospects to exchange their details for a lead magnet, sign up to an email list and ultimately convert into paying customers.
[00:47]
Darren Jamieson: Your business has a very unusual name, doesn’t it? It’s Sparkle Society.
Emma Sidney: That’s what I’ve come up with for now!
I’m a bit of a multi-passionate creative, and Sparkle Society really does fit with what I do and what it’s about. However, these things are always subject to change as we grow.
I also do quite a lot under my own name because, hopefully, that will stay the same.
Darren Jamieson: You never can tell, can you?
Emma Sidney: No!
Sparkle Society was something I finally settled on early in the year. I hadn’t found a name that really resonated with me for a very long time.
[01:24]
I kept talking about how I wanted to help businesses sparkle and stand out, and the name came from there.
I’m not a huge fan of labels, but at the same time, I know that people like labels. They help people understand what I do, how I help and what I offer.
Psychologically, however, labels can sometimes become a bit of a weight around our necks. That’s why I have mixed feelings about them.
[02:34]
Darren Jamieson: So “sparkle” didn’t come from Twilight? It’s not about the sparkly vampires in Twilight?
Emma Sidney: No, I’ve never seen Twilight.
Darren Jamieson: You’re not missing much, to be honest.
Emma Sidney: When I was growing up, I used to like Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Darren Jamieson: Buffy was brilliant.
Emma Sidney: I was quite a fan of Angel.
Darren Jamieson: Who doesn’t love Angel? David Boreanaz.
I’ve met Spike—James Marsters—at a convention.
Emma Sidney: He’s really cool. He’s been in quite a few other things as well, although I can’t remember what they are because I have baby brain at the moment.
[03:14]
Darren Jamieson: He was in Torchwood as well.
Emma Sidney: That’s what I was thinking of! I’m quite a big Doctor Who fan, so that’s where I know him from.
Darren Jamieson: You’ve said the magic words. I’m a big Doctor Who fan.
Emma Sidney: So am I.
Darren Jamieson: I’ve met most of the living Doctors.
Emma Sidney: Have you?
Darren Jamieson: Oh, yes. In fact, some people say I look a bit like Christopher Eccleston.
Emma Sidney: I don’t know. You’d need to be wearing the leather jacket to get the full effect.
[03:52]
Darren Jamieson: When I had more definition in my face, perhaps I did look a little like him. I was even entered into a Christopher Eccleston lookalike competition in one of those television magazines—TV Quick, Chat or something like that.
I didn’t win.
We could talk about Doctor Who forever, but we’ll try not to. I did a podcast with somebody else a while ago, we mentioned Doctor Who, and then we talked about it for about an hour and a half.
Emma Sidney: We’ll try not to do that. Although I’m also a Formula One fan and a science-fiction fan, so it’s a bit different.
Darren Jamieson: I love it. Fantastic.
[04:24]
Let’s talk a little bit about marketing.
One of the things you do is help people with their lead magnets, email marketing and the whole customer journey.
For anyone listening who doesn’t know what one is, how would you define a lead magnet?
Emma Sidney: Typically, a lead magnet is a piece of content. A lot of people overcomplicate it, but it is simply something of value that you offer for “free”.
Essentially, you offer it in exchange for somebody’s email address so that they enter what I like to call your “email world”.
[05:05]
You can then begin to build a different kind of relationship with them through email.
It is always about adding value and providing something useful. It is the first step in somebody’s journey with you outside social media.
Social media is a big, cavernous place. We like it, and it’s fine, but a lead magnet gives you a way to build that relationship further.
That’s my opinion, anyway.
Darren Jamieson: For anyone listening who has a business, a website and a social media following, they might be wondering why they need a lead magnet.
Why do they need to get people onto an email list? What’s wrong with people simply following them on Facebook or LinkedIn?
[05:42]
Emma Sidney: There’s nothing wrong with that.
As I mentioned, I don’t like labels, and I also don’t like the approach that says, “You must do these things. Every other way is wrong, so you have to do it this way.”
That kind of approach drives me mad.
However, there are lots of reasons to build an email list. One is that you aren’t always seen on social media. You might need to publish a lot of content before people notice and connect with you because it’s such a busy space.
[06:16]
Some people say, “I don’t open emails, so why should anybody else open mine?”
In reality, plenty of people still open and read emails, and many people want to connect in that way.
Email is a good way for somebody to get to know you, your business and what you have to offer.
I’ve started using a restaurant analogy. People often say that your social media and website are your shop window. In this analogy, they are the front of your restaurant.
[06:50]
Getting somebody onto your email list is like getting them through the door and speaking to your maître d’.
Your email marketing can be like the drinks menu because it weaves through everything you can do with your business.
Equally, it can be as simple as offering somebody one drink. They accept it, you start chatting, and now you’re having a conversation because they’ve come through the door.
Darren Jamieson: I asked somebody this question recently.
Suppose you have a lead magnet—and we’ll discuss designing lead magnets and landing pages in a moment—what’s the best way to get somebody from social media to your lead magnet? How do you get them to convert?
[07:59]
Emma Sidney: As with everything, it starts with understanding who you are as a business, what your messaging is and the journey you are going to take people on.
That’s why I use the restaurant analogy. You need to set up a restaurant that appeals to the right person.
You can then use social media to promote your lead magnet or talk to people about it.
The basic message is: “I’m going to help you with this one simple thing.”
For example, imagine that you are a product-based business selling bathroom accessories.
[08:36]
You could create a lead magnet about how to make the most of your bathroom accessories. You can then use your own products to demonstrate the advice.
It is about thinking through the entire journey and identifying that first step. You need to make it appealing.
You can create a landing page and do all sorts of other things, but don’t become too bogged down in them. Those things can be very simple. It doesn’t have to be complicated.
Of course, you can make it complicated if you want to. There is no single right answer.
[09:11]
It depends on where you are as a business and what you are trying to do.
One of my best-performing lead magnets is a PDF about creating content more easily. It is very simple, but it works.
Using the bathroom-products example, you could create something like “Five Steps to Using and Positioning Your Toothbrush Holder”. You could even produce something about choosing the best colour.
It can be that simple because somebody will see it and think, “I need to know that.”
[09:42]
You can have a very simple landing page. What matters next is how you nurture people after they sign up.
Darren Jamieson: Is there a particular way you title lead magnets? How important is the title, and how do you structure it so that somebody wants the lead magnet?
Emma Sidney: I’ll be honest: I’m absolutely rubbish at coming up with titles!
I can show people how to work through the content, choose an idea and create a process for developing a successful lead magnet.
[10:14]
However, when it comes to titles, it is often best to take a “does what it says on the tin” approach rather than overcomplicating things.
Another useful tool—and this may be controversial—is something like ChatGPT.
You can enter the details of your lead magnet, explain what it does and what problem it solves, and then ask it to suggest some titles.
Ultimately, you only find out whether people want something after you put it in front of them.
[10:50]
A lead magnet is only worth what people think it is worth.
When you put it out there, people may not sign up. That doesn’t necessarily mean the lead magnet itself is wrong. You can look at the title and other elements, then ask how you could change or reposition it.
You might rebadge it or present it differently.
There is no perfect way to do this. In my opinion, formulas that claim to give you the one correct answer do not reflect real life. We’re all human beings.
I’m a big fan of ChatGPT for coming up with title ideas because titles are not my strength.
[11:23]
Darren Jamieson: You mentioned landing pages and said some can be very simple while others are overcomplicated.
Is there anything a landing page absolutely has to include to convert somebody from being interested to entering their name and email address?
Emma Sidney: It has to cover the basics, which means talking directly to the right person.
If you try to speak to every one of the billions of people in the world, nobody will pay attention.
The page needs to explain what problem the lead magnet solves, what it is and who it is for.
[12:24]
It doesn’t have to be for “Nigel, who sits at number 10”, but it does need to be specific enough for somebody to recognise that it is relevant to them.
It could be for a Doctor Who fan, for example, if that’s the direction of your business.
Somebody should be able to look at it and think, “Yes, I need this.”
Going back to the bathroom example, somebody who is currently renovating their bathroom might need advice about choosing a colour.
The message has to speak to the person you want to attract. Generic messaging doesn’t work.
[13:03]
If you appeal to several different groups of people, you can use the same format but create different forms and wording for each audience.
You could have one version for LinkedIn and another for a different platform. You’re simply tweaking the wording. It doesn’t have to be rocket science.
Darren Jamieson: So, if you have different types of customers, you can adapt the landing page to each one.
An obvious example would be an estate agent. They have people who want to rent houses and people who want to rent houses out—tenants and landlords.
[13:32]
They are involved in the same process but sit at opposite ends of it.
The estate agent could have a similar lead magnet but use very different landing pages, each addressing the problems of a different type of customer.
They could still enter the same funnel and email software because both groups are potential clients of the letting agent.
Emma Sidney: They would enter the same software, but they shouldn’t necessarily be nurtured in exactly the same way.
Behind the scenes, you would communicate with each group slightly differently.
[14:04]
You can still use the same overall framework, but once people enter your email world, the conversation needs to reflect who they are.
You can look at the commonalities, decide how to move the relationship forward and adapt the experience without having to create completely separate systems.
Darren Jamieson: Once somebody joins the list, you’re presumably using email autoresponders to communicate with them.
They receive automated messages over a period of time. How do you structure those messages in terms of timing and content?
[14:38]
Emma Sidney: Traditionally, when somebody downloads a lead magnet, they enter what is called a welcome email sequence.
That is a series of emails that takes them on a journey. It provides value, tells them what you have to offer and helps them get to know you as a business.
It is a nurturing sequence.
The ideal frequency depends on your audience.
For some audiences, a daily email may be appropriate. However, when people first sign up, be clear about what they should expect.
[15:08]
You might say, “Over the next week, I’m going to send you a series of emails to help you get to know me. After that, I’ll send you a monthly email.”
That way, they don’t receive a daily email and think, “Am I going to get one of these every day forever? I can’t stand this—it’s too much.”
For my audience, I normally send the emails in a welcome sequence every couple of days. That feels a little gentler.
My audience consists largely of businesspeople who already receive a lot of emails.
[15:43]
For an estate agent’s audience, however, daily emails might work because somebody may urgently need the information.
You have to test it. Look at what people open, what they don’t open and where they drop off.
Then return to the sequence and tweak it over time.
This isn’t something you create once and then leave alone. You test and improve it.
Darren Jamieson: So it’s about constantly monitoring the results, finding ways to improve and trying to achieve better outcomes.
Emma Sidney: Absolutely.
[16:19]
Darren Jamieson: Do you have any tips for email subject lines?
Emails are notorious for not being opened, not being delivered or going into spam folders. We all receive hundreds of spam and promotional emails.
How do you cut through that noise and get your email opened?
Emma Sidney: Again, it depends on your audience.
It is also about being clear from the beginning about how frequently you will contact them.
There are two things to bear in mind. The first is how often you can realistically do it because we all have limited capacity.
[16:51]
How often can you write to your list consistently?
It is better to write once a month or once a quarter than to send three emails one month and then disappear for three months.
People need to understand when they are going to hear from you. That way, they will expect your emails and want to hear from you.
There will always be a percentage that bounce or go unopened.
As for captivating subject lines, my answer is similar to my answer about lead-magnet titles.
[17:29]
It is not something I consider myself particularly good at, but ChatGPT can generate some very good subject lines.
You can write your email, paste it into ChatGPT and ask it to suggest an appealing subject line.
You can also test different subject lines by sending them to different parts of your audience and seeing what works. That is a slightly more advanced approach, but it helps you learn what people respond to.
Personalisation can work for some audiences.
[18:07]
When you capture somebody’s details, some email tools allow you to include their name in the subject line.
Your audience may like that, but much of this comes back to understanding the people you are talking to.
A business audience may think, “I get tonnes of emails,” because entrepreneurs often sign up for lots of things.
An estate agent’s audience may have a very different attitude towards receiving email.
I often hear people say, “I don’t read emails, so other people won’t read them either. I sign up for lots of things and my inbox is flooded.”
[18:40]
But you are not necessarily your audience.
You have to get your own beliefs out of the way.
I’m the same. I periodically go through my inbox and unsubscribe from things I don’t read.
At the moment, I’m following somebody who sends daily emails. Occasionally, I look at them because I think the subject matter could be useful for something I want to discuss, but most of the time I can’t be bothered to unsubscribe.
[19:12]
I received an email today with a subject line along the lines of, “Thank you for being part of my summit.”
I thought, “I haven’t been part of your summit.”
She must have run a summit, and although I hadn’t registered for it, she sent that message to her entire list.
In some respects, it worked because I opened the email, but then I wondered why I had received it.
That demonstrates why email marketing is about more than the subject line. It is also about your audience and the relevance of the message.
[19:51]
Darren Jamieson: What you said about not being your target audience is so true.
Just because you don’t like receiving daily emails doesn’t mean your clients won’t like them.
I come across that all the time, particularly in web design.
A client might say, “I don’t like that particular web design. It’s not right for me.”
But it isn’t designed for them. It is designed for their target customer.
Or somebody says, “I don’t like using Facebook. I’m not a Facebook fan.”
But their target audience is on Facebook, so they need to accept that and get used to it.
[20:23]
It is a big blocker for business owners, isn’t it?
They think, “Because I don’t like this, I’m not going to use it,” and they struggle to accept that it is where their audience is.
Emma Sidney: Yes.
My background includes neurolinguistic programming and how the brain works. I love brain-related topics, although I don’t always talk about them.
There is a part of the brain called the reticular activating system. It filters out irrelevant information and helps us achieve our goals.
[20:50]
If you aren’t speaking to your audience’s reticular activating system, you aren’t helping them to achieve their goals, so they will filter you out as irrelevant information.
Although I don’t advertise it heavily—because whenever I have tried, people haven’t bought it—one of the biggest areas in which I help people is understanding their audience and ideal client.
It is about thinking through who they are and how you craft what you do for them.
Ironically, many of my recommendations say, “Emma really helped me understand my ideal client, go back to basics and do the things I thought I didn’t need.”
[21:28]
People often have mental blocks around ideal clients.
They think, “I can’t have only one,” or, “I can’t do this.”
But we need to put ourselves in our audience’s shoes as much as possible.
We have to recognise that we cannot do it perfectly because we are human beings, but as you said, we sometimes need to get our own ego and personal preferences out of the way.
We need to ask, “What do they think they need?” rather than, “What do I think they need?”
Darren Jamieson: Let’s get a little technical.
When it comes to creating landing pages, what software do you like to use?
[22:04]
Emma Sidney: My recommendation is MailerLite, both for landing pages and email marketing.
I’ve tried many systems over the years and worked with clients using several others. Out of all of them, I think MailerLite is the easiest to use.
Once you understand it, you understand it. It also gives you good foundations if you later want to move to something more complicated.
In my opinion, most people don’t need the more complicated systems. They’ll probably hate me for saying that!
You can do a lot with MailerLite.
[22:38]
It has a substantial free package. I think you can create five or perhaps ten landing pages.
You can build plenty of automations and send email campaigns.
It also has very good help sections.
People often ask, “How do I do this?” My advice is to look at the help section for the software you are using.
Some are better than others, but MailerLite’s help documentation is good.
Even if you eventually move onto a paid package, it isn’t ridiculously expensive.
I have a course on building a funnel in MailerLite.
[23:10]
I also use MemberVault as a course platform and Smart System for some things, alongside MailerLite.
You need to focus on where you are today.
One of the biggest problems is that people jump into expensive software or email platforms and then never use them.
I have worked with clients who were using four or five tools that had started to offer many of the same functions.
They were spending around £500—or dollars, because many of the platforms are American—every month.
My approach is to simplify things, prove that the idea works, bring in some money and then develop from there.
[23:54]
Darren Jamieson: You can go completely overboard with software.
ClickFunnels is one of the premium options for landing pages. I think we originally had it for $97 a month, but I don’t believe that offer exists anymore. What we use may now cost around $150 a month.
That doesn’t include the email-marketing side of ClickFunnels. That can cost another couple of hundred dollars a month.
ClickFunnels can integrate with something such as Mailchimp, ActiveCampaign or MailerLite, so you can use the landing page and pass the leads into one of those systems.
[24:30]
If you want to run webinars, you might add WebinarJam, which can cost around $500 a year.
For automated webinars, you might add EverWebinar for another $500 a year.
If you want to take payments across different parts of Europe and calculate VAT automatically, you may need something such as ThriveCart, which is another $500.
The costs keep going up and up until your software expenses become ridiculous and completely out of control.
You then discover that you aren’t using the software you paid for, and the business isn’t making any profit.
[25:09]
Emma Sidney: Exactly.
I’ve recently started using Smart System, which is an all-in-one platform. It includes the ability to create funnels and pages similar to ClickFunnels.
I’m beginning to explore it for myself.
Because I take people on a journey, I don’t like telling everybody, “You must use X, Y and Z.”
The system is about to relaunch. It was created by a British developer who wants to make it an affordable platform, so it won’t cost hundreds of pounds.
However, it is more complicated to use.
[25:42]
From a technical point of view, you can buy into one of these systems, but then you have to learn how to use it—or pay somebody else to do it for you.
For a long time, it is worth asking how complicated your setup really needs to be.
One of the things I do is sit down and ask: “What is my journey? What restaurant am I creating? What is on the menu, and where do I want to take people?”
Often, the simpler software will still do what you need.
[26:21]
Even in MailerLite, although it may not have all the order-bump features, you can still create a landing page.
I know we’re talking about lead magnets, but you can also create a paid landing page. Somebody subscribes through the page and then follows a link to make a payment.
Alternatively, you can have a lead-magnet landing page that takes the person to what MailerLite calls a success page.
A success page is potentially a gold mine because you can use it to say, “I also have this course that can help you further.”
[26:50]
That keeps things simple while still giving you the beginnings of a funnel or customer journey that can earn money.
If you are paying MailerLite $10 a month and linking it to a paid product, that is a simple setup you can test.
You can prove that it works and make sure it is scalable before investing in systems such as WebinarJam.
I worked with one woman who had EasyWebinar, a course platform, a payment platform and several other tools.
[27:20]
Over time, many of the platforms had started to do the same things. Several could create landing pages, for example.
The setup had become ridiculous.
We stripped everything back and asked which single system could achieve what she was trying to do.
She wasn’t fully using many of the tools either.
My philosophy is to keep things as simple as possible.
Darren Jamieson: I see that so often.
People take out software subscriptions they don’t need. They aren’t using the software and don’t even know what it does.
[27:58]
It is almost as if they have been sold the dream that the software will become their complete marketing solution, bring hundreds of leads into the business and create exponential growth.
In reality, they don’t even log in. They simply continue paying for it.
It’s tragic in a way.
Emma Sidney: It is.
Darren Jamieson: When you work with a client who wants a lead magnet—or perhaps already has one that isn’t working—what process do you use?
[28:28]
Emma Sidney: It depends on the situation.
I recently started offering a lead-magnet audit. I review the whole journey and provide advice on what could be improved.
When creating a lead magnet, I have an existing course and several ways of working through the process.
I use a framework that considers the problem you are going to solve, the bigger picture and the overall journey.
I tend to approach different projects in different ways.
When I work one-to-one with somebody, it is often because they want to create a larger paid course or programme.
[29:01]
We start with that paid offer and work backwards to identify the type of lead magnet that fits it.
A lead magnet—or even a mini-course—works much better when it leads naturally towards what you sell.
Darren Jamieson: What do you mean by that?
Emma Sidney: Begin by looking at what you offer.
Suppose your business is based on knitting, or perhaps you sell Doctor Who memorabilia.
If you are going to offer knitting classes, your lead magnet should connect to those classes.
[29:34]
You might be targeting beginners who don’t know how to knit.
Your lead magnet could show them how to attach the wool to the needle or knit their first stitch.
That very basic information then leads naturally to the paid course in which you teach them how to knit.
Rather than saying, “My business is about knitting, so I’ll create a random guide about knitting a square,” think about where you ultimately want to take the person.
How will this lead to something you are paid for?
[30:08]
It is also about identifying the problem the person has and what will bring them to you.
For example, when I was in my twenties, I was very overweight and suffered from anxiety and panic attacks.
I became interested in personal development and crafting. I attended craft workshops and became obsessed with making jewellery because it gave me a space in which I could be imperfect.
A business could therefore approach knitting from the angle of somebody who is struggling with their mental health, feeling stressed or very busy.
[30:44]
The first step could be learning to knit.
That may be an extreme example, but it demonstrates the point.
You will have a mission and a purpose behind your business, but you also need to consider how you will lead people towards something that earns money.
I strongly believe in purpose-led businesses, making a difference and working with people who care about those things.
However, those people can become so caught up in the purpose that they forget to ask how they will actually get paid.
[31:23]
When I started as a nutrition and life coach, I created freebies all the time.
I made all sorts of things, but none of them led anywhere. I then wondered why I wasn’t making any sales.
That was around ten years ago, when lead magnets were still relatively new.
Darren Jamieson: That will sound familiar to a lot of business owners and perhaps website marketers.
They’ve created lead magnets, put them on their websites and had people download them.
Then nothing happened.
[31:56]
They think, “Lots of people downloaded this. I presume they looked at it, read it or watched it, but they didn’t become clients.”
Where does that process go wrong?
What was the missing step you didn’t have before but understand now?
Emma Sidney: I think there are two missing steps.
First, the lead magnet must connect to an offer.
If you are a service-based business, it should solve a problem that then leads naturally to your larger service.
[32:38]
For example, I have a lead magnet about creating a successful lead magnet.
That naturally leads to my Lead Magnetic course.
That is the first step: make sure the lead magnet takes people on a journey towards something paid.
It cannot simply be a random resource that is loosely related to what you do.
How are you going to be paid if it doesn’t lead anywhere?
The next step is what happens after somebody joins your list.
I recently created a course about this because I realised it was a gap for many people.
[33:17]
You need to think about how you nurture your email list and what you do with it.
People often drop new subscribers into a random automated sequence that doesn’t even tell them there is something they can buy.
Alternatively, they think, “You’re in my world now, so I’ll send you a random newsletter every now and then.”
That doesn’t necessarily help your business.
Sometimes they only send something when they can be bothered, because they believe people don’t read email.
That isn’t a helpful mindset.
The better question is: “How can I nurture these people?”
[33:48]
Everything needs to connect.
I was recording a module about email campaigns this morning. It asks people to consider what they plan to promote over the next twelve months.
You may have a product that you want to showcase. How can you connect that product to your email campaigns and the content you publish?
At the next level, you can start segmenting your list.
Please don’t switch off when I say that, because there is a progression in business.
When I created this course, I included different routes for beginners, inconsistent marketers and more advanced users.
[34:20]
You can segment your list into people who have bought from you and people who entered your world through something free.
You can then write your email campaigns slightly differently.
For existing customers, you could create a VIP-style experience that makes them feel special and encourages repeat business.
For people who joined through a free resource, you may create a different campaign.
You might think, “You came into my world through this freebie. I’m launching a course next year, so how can I nurture you towards that?”
[34:46]
That whole experience and journey behind the scenes is often what is missing.
People are simply dropped into an email list. A random campaign is sent occasionally, without much thought about the journey or the customer’s overall experience.
Social media tends to receive more strategic attention. People say, “I have a social media plan, and I’m doing this and that.”
You also need to connect your channels.
For example, if you have published a blog post, tell the people on your email list about it.
[35:18]
It is about making the whole system work together.
Too often, somebody creates a random free resource related to their business, people sign up, and then they receive unrelated campaigns.
I’ve had people ask, “Why would I want to send emails when the emails I receive are rubbish?”
Darren Jamieson: That’s precisely why you should do it well. There’s no point in simply becoming part of the crowd. You want to be a little different.
You mentioned your membership and courses. I presume you create video content for those as well.
[35:53]
Emma Sidney: I teach people how to create courses as part of this because a course can be free or paid, and a webinar can also form part of the structure.
I help people decide which format is right.
I have a course called Demystifying Email Marketing.
It includes video training, but a lot of the content is also written.
For example, it explains the steps a beginner needs to take and includes the relevant training, but the learner then needs to go away, create the campaign and write the emails.
[36:25]
Because I have a coaching background, much of my course teaching is action-focused.
I may explain what somebody needs to do, but then the emphasis is on taking action and addressing the mindset behind it.
The course teaches them to create their email-marketing strategy, decide what to focus on and build the campaigns.
They then need to create their own templates and put the work into practice.
I don’t advocate putting something into a course if it isn’t necessary.
[37:01]
I do create a lot of video content, but much of the feedback I receive is that people also want something written down.
They want screenshots they can follow while they work through the process.
When somebody signs up for Demystifying Email Marketing, they also receive access to my Build a Budget Funnel in MailerLite training.
That contains a lot of video because I demonstrate exactly how to complete the technical steps.
[37:31]
Video walkthroughs and screenshots are useful for things such as automation.
When it comes to nurturing, however, people often simply need the steps required to create their customer journey and understand their ideal client.
That doesn’t always require a video. They need to go away and do the work.
Does that make sense?
Darren Jamieson: It does.
Incredibly, we’re almost out of time.
Who is able to do this, and what level of skill does somebody need before they can benefit from what you teach?
How much do they need to know already?
[38:03]
Emma Sidney: Because I’ve become more focused on lead-magnet marketing and courses, I have designed the material so that it works for beginners, people who are already doing some of it but not effectively, and more advanced users.
That sense of progression is often missing.
For example, Demystifying Email Marketing was very complicated to build, although I have been creating courses for ten years, so I was able to do it.
It has a route for beginners that explains the strategy they need, how to set up a list and which steps to take.
[38:29]
It also has guidance for somebody who is inconsistent and material for somebody ready to become more advanced.
I have separate modules for coaches, virtual assistants, bookkeepers and other types of businesses.
I’ve tried to think about how I can help different people within the niche of email marketing and lead magnets, while still keeping my ideal client in mind.
Darren Jamieson: So it is one course, but it has sections that apply to different industries.
Emma Sidney: Yes.
[38:59]
That gives people relevant examples and gets them thinking.
It is still reasonably general because, for example, there are many different types of craft business.
However, I might suggest a particular lead magnet that a craft business could create.
The purpose is to generate that lightbulb moment in which somebody thinks, “That’s how this could apply to me. That’s what I need to consider as part of my strategy.”
The course itself isn’t specifically a lead-generation course because I have a separate live programme on list building and creating a lead magnet.
[39:35]
I still speak to my ideal client, but I spend time in many business groups, and people often ask, “I’m an accountant. How is this relevant to me?”
That’s how the industry-specific examples developed.
Darren Jamieson: The essence of marketing is based on the same principles. You simply make small adjustments for different industries and applications.
Emma Sidney: Exactly.
Darren Jamieson: Finally, for somebody who is interested in what you’ve said and likes the idea of lead magnets, a lead-magnet audit or learning how to create a membership or course, what is the best way to contact you and find out more?
[40:04]
Emma Sidney: The easiest way is to find me on Facebook. Search for Emma Sidney.
I’m also on LinkedIn. Facebook and LinkedIn are my two favourite places to spend time.
My username is consistently EmmaSidneyCoUk across the different platforms.
I don’t use my Facebook page as much as I could, but it is still a way to contact me.
Using the same username everywhere means people can find me easily on different platforms.
[40:36]
Darren Jamieson: I’ll put links to both your Facebook and LinkedIn profiles in the description beneath the video and the podcast so that people can contact you.
Emma, thank you very much for being on the podcast.
I’ve loved talking to you about funnels, automations and marketing. It’s been a pleasure.
Emma Sidney: Thank you.
